CBT 2 Closing Thoughts

[Genji]

And just like that two weeks have passed and Supernova servers will be shutting down for a time on Monday, November 30th, 2015. Until when, only the devs know.

With their closure, its time to think about what worked, what didn't and how to improve. So, to help in that endeavor I've created this post in order to help aggregate player's opinions. Please feel free to reply to this thread with your thoughts on this phase of the CBT. You can use the following as a guide to help organize your thoughts.

-What I liked about this phase
-What i think should be changed.
-What would i like to see in future phases

I'm curious too see what others thought about this phase.

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What I liked:
I liked the changes to certain Rank 3 proficiencies. I think it helped strengthen certain proficiencies that didn't quite the oomph to make them mainstays in builds. I'm curious to see how other proficiencies might be altered in future as i think its an interesting mechanic.

I liked the Jungle buff execution. I liked how it didn't go the traditional route that most MOBAs have gone. Its definitely made the jungle a bit more prominent in the game play. Hopefully this will be a step to make so that there are a variety of options in terms of roles and game play.

Of course, Itarri was pretty awesome as well. I think she showcases the uniqueness of Supernova and I look forward to seeing more commanders like her in the future.

What I think should be changed
While I liked the changes to the rank 3 proficiencies, I feel like it only really made strong proficiencies more optimal and so so ones relatively blase. Life Drain was already a questionable proficiency and the change to rank 3 made it even more unattractive. It would have been nice if it had the multistrike passive effect. That would have made it much more passive and competitive over all.

While I like the buffs for the jungle, it still seems lacking. I'm not sure if its just that buffs doesn't seem to be impactful or just the visual landscape is too bleak. The Upgrade modules still seem to be the most impactful of all the objectives outside of mechnaught.

As for commanders, Reptus, Mort and Nyx could use some serious love. They seem to be falling behind their contemporaries in terms of play-ability. Their performance seems to be consistently poor, having very few windows of power and become irrelevant if under leveled/built. Nyx in particular has a hard time really making an impact in lane or team fights. Reptus can be an early game bully but falls off really hard towards the mid and late game. He requires so many different things that its hard to build him into an effective anything. Mort as a whole works so-so as power or WD. Both builds have very exploitable flaws.

What I would like to see
Honestly, I'm content as we have more commanders to play around with. I have a hard time playing just one or two commanders. I look forward to seeing all of the commanders Primal has in the works.

However, I would like to see if Proficiencies could have a branching system. At rank three instead of having one effect, players would be able to choose one of two bonuses. It would make for a lot of strategic choices and builds. I really thought the ME3 ability system really interesting. It made every rank of each ability customizable.

[hangun]

However, I would like to see if Proficiencies could have a branching system.

im gonna leave this here

http://dawngate.gamepedia.com/Items

dawngate had an item system that could work for sn..with branches that was quite uniqe and cool but the most important thing is to keep everything balanced so that you will have situational options too rather than just have one way of build ur commander.cuz most of the times in dawngate i end up building the same 4-5 out of 6 items every game.

[karottenkoenig]

a problem i ran into over and over again was an increase of queue dodging by certain players if they were matched against veterans or with people they thaught where bad. even have them bragging about that in global chat, wich made finding a game nearly impossible at some times. i get that some people have random disconnects in champselect due to bad connections, so i dont think the first disconnect should be punished, but there should be a commulative penalty from the second dodge onward.

i know that may suck for people with bad connection, but as someone playing from europe with a high ping and sometimes laggs in game, i NEVER had a disconnect in championselect. neither this phase, nor last phase.
90% of the people disconnecting have somehow an absolutely fine connection in queue, in game or in lobby when they are paired with particulare players. and while it might suck for the few players that actually have problems with their connection, the game overall would benefit from that in my opinion.

also with a growing playerbase we need an ingame report system. i had the feeling this beta phase was much harsher in tone than the last one and more people again and again left on purpose, straight up trolled or flamed.
i know we can write support tickets outside of the game, but it would be much more efficient if 4 teammates could just press report after the game without the hassle.
the system at this time encourages bad behaviour, because people know they most of the time get away with it.

also please implement the option to mute players in game

[Gruwolf]

Well said Genno TM

Gru

[WillDragon]

So much time passed by and the game still hasn't an accept lobby button. Sometimes players are doing something else rather than siting in front of the computer waiting for the lobby to pop (wich can take awhile sometimes). I've suggested this long ago, as others alpha players but still nothing was done about it. Therefore, there will still be players afk at lobby sometimes for that reason.
Regarding dodging in lobby, I see people complaining about it and asking for time penalties. Time penalties for dodgers was implemented long time ago therefore I don't understand why people still ask for it.
As long as the game continues to pair players with others in their block list, its logical that some dodge the queue. A game is supposed to provide fun, and there's no fun playing with people we dislike for some reason. And game does give time penalty for who dodge lobby. Me myself dodged sometimes, I didn't brag about it, I just find more logical to wait some minutes for next lobby rather than have to play at least 15 minutes with someone in my block list.
One thing I've disliked was the non announced end of this CB2. I wasn't announced by email, main site, forums, social networks, nothing. Players that follow this game since early alpha stages, no matter how short is the playerbase and long time waiting queues, should at least receive a little consideration and be notified about the end of the CB2. In my case, I've only found out when I logged in today and saw Himura writing about it. Not even on "News" window was announced.
I'll move to a new city next year with a decent internet because playing this game with a stone age 600k internet is quite a challenge, seeing things happening some time after I click some button.
So c u all in next phase and expect a little more challenge from me with my new internet

[Maroto]

There's one thing I think could be easily fixed and could help those who don't know all the commanders and happened to me when I started playing:

If you have 2 loadouts set, 1 for weapon dmg based and other for energy based commanders, once you get to the commander selection tab there's nothing that tells you your commander's type of damage. Even if you click the info button, if you don't know your numbers, you can be confused as to which loadout you should chose to suit your selection. Maybe include the bonus damage in the abilities' description as you can see ingame.

Regarding gameplay and commanders, I'll leave it to the pros

[WillDragon]

That was also suggested before, putting in skills description with what they scale with, WD, Armor, Power, HP, etc. Maybe in future they will provide that. I still remember what I had to do in early alpha to discouver that info, I've used all commanders in practice mode just to see the skills scales

[Genji]

ClanSks.com still has probably the most current information regarding commander scalings Most of them should be accurate as most commanders haven't had drastic changes from Alpha.

Again, it would be nice if they put that in game. There a number places that could be placed.

[RedEyedRaven]

To be perfectly honest, I didn't feel any difference in CBT2.... perhaps it's just me, because I barely had the opportunity to test it out, but overall I felt like picking it up where I left when CBT1 ended.

Also.. why was phase 2 that darn short?

[Genji]

The reason they gave for the short period is that they wanted to do some load/stress testing. Why, i dunno.

And your right the changes between closed beta phases has been very subtle. Even the changes between Alpha and Beta have been subtle to say the least, mostly QoL changes to help make the game run more smoothly.

Maybe next CBT will be revolutionary, its hard to tell. We just have to wait and see.

[karottenkoenig]

exactly this. the changes for players were marginal and small changes that could have been easily added over the downtime still arent implemented. it was fun, but it didt meet my expectations after the downtime. i had really hoped for major changes due to the break

[Genji]

I think the best answer to this is direction. The large gap in between phases makes me think that they are trying to determine where to go with the game. I think CBT2 has given them another resource to make informed decisions about how to proceed.

it may not be the most satisfying but at least they are taking their time to make a quality game. Granted, some might question the quality at this stage, but I think its worthwhile for them to progress at their own pace. After all, they have a lot to lose if this game isn't well received. A player's time line and a developers time line are very different. The stakes are also much more real for a dev has they are relying on a product to generate income to meet their daily necessities. For Players, its a means of passing time and socializing.

That might be a bit preachier then I intended, but its what i've come to understand. Good games take time, and that's what i'm interested in playing, a good game. If they need time and testing to figure that out , fine by me.

[BN_Stormshade]

I love this thread soooo much!

[BN_Stormshade]

[karottenkoenig]

i am all for devs taking their time. especially when they arent in the position of lets say bethesda, who are able to release an unfinished game, because the community will do the bugfixing and polishing for them in the first week ^^

[Genji]

I've tried doing something similar last phase when it was between Alpha and Beta. Seemed like a good way to keep the community engaged with the game.

It would be nice to see some of the newer players participating in the forums as well as the vets. Although, I feel like a lot of the vets are mainly waiting for a huge groundbreaking update before they participate again. And those who are newer to the scene may have already left because of the way matchmaking has gone. Its hard not to get a little bitter when your out gunned from the get go.

All I can do is help encourage people to express their thoughts and feelings on the game. You know, the whole lead a horse to water bit?

[karottenkoenig]

but seriously. put in the accept match button already

[karottenkoenig]

Regarding dodging in lobby, I see people complaining about it and asking for time penalties. Time penalties for dodgers was implemented long time ago therefore I don't understand why people still ask for it.

if it is implemented, it is buggy as hell. i played duo with someone who dodged 5 times in a row and just got back to queue every time. as someone with a pretty long friendlist, i saw the same players displayed as in lobby, go offline and jump into queue/lobby directly after relogging just to repeat that until hsuku is on their team. as far as i can tell, this penalty system doesnt work.

[Dark_Lord_Malus]

I suppose I should give my input huh?

Ahem here's my opinion on it.

I found this phase was one of the best phases so far. The matches were a lot faster to play and faster to come out, and it could be due to a larger player base, but I know 2-3 games were going at a time, instead of just 1. Once again, due to the small player base, we can't truly test the match making's ELO system. However, the fact is, matches were coming. During this phase, new players found out something: Sniper's snowball in the hands of good players. And this created a problem. It's not that snipers are over powered ((Quite the opposite, Counter Carry Tanks, like Bloat, Blaze, Maxim are the strongest)).

The problem here, is that snipers snowball early with a little carry damage or crit, and then their numbers are very high as they will simply outscale most defensive masteries except Reflection, which is a bad mastery to take first ((Its best as your 2nd one.)) While the game is fun with its new faster pace, its also quite annoying to see people entirely give up because a Vikka got fed and even though she has no team mates to rely on, they believe that snipers are over powered as a result.

I do like the new 3rd tier stuff. I feel like however, with some of them ((Life drain)) they actually make the ability less appealing. Frankly, the armies still feel a little underwhelming at time. I think its due to the lack of units. In the end, everyone ends up using the same army unless they bought unique units. Once you get the two unique units, you end up replacing 2 units ((for humans, we usually replace mosquito's and tactical engineers)) And all use this. This makes units feel less rewarding.

Here are some changes I'd personally do

-Reduce the of Attribute Shards received from kills until 4:00 minutes in, when they reach full value. ((level 1 kills pretty much assure a victory in a lane making you snowball very hard, or zone the opponent away from XP and Attribute Shards)).
-Add in the Accept Match button. This will help a lot.
-Add more buyable units to create more army composition potential
-Buff armor ((In the early game. It's late game value's should still be near the same, maybe slightly higher at best.))
-More Power commanders. With the game as it is, Power commanders feel like they are lacking the ability to influence the game as Power commanders. Valendre doesn't really spike in power until way late game. Mortanica is often played as AS or power ((by Rift alone)). Blaze tends to get 1-2 powers and then goes straight tank. Nyx is very underwhelming right now. Slith is the ONLY viable power commander right now where he can be viable from level 1 to 15.

[Invisible_Man]

I actually stopped playing too much of the game early on since I had gone through earlier versions of it so much already.

This phase I actually took the time to go crazy with the game and felt like it has come a long way since the start.

I felt like snipers were very powerful and very hard to handle 1-on-1 unless you got the jump on them or hit them with CC. Of course they'll do a lot of damage but there are certain masteries too that your frontline should grab to disable a fed sniper. I'm not a good sniper lol so I can't say much on this.

Tanks were easily one of my favorite classes (Galagat and Targon). I tend to like CC bruisers that deal decent damage and cause havoc during teamfights (or start fights). I really feel like tanks are some of the strongest in the game due to their ability to take hits and also dish out decent damage in the process. In fact if a tank gets ahead early game they become too powerful mid-game if you start building damage. Overall, bruiser/tanks are just really effective when played in an aggressive fashion. Utility though is something that is necessary as CC effectively ensures you'll kill somebody.

Ability commanders seem to be powerful briefly but they are more about their timing and when they enter a fight. If they get the drop on you then they'll most likely win the encounter. If they come in the middle of a fight and nobody focuses them they'll be really effective. Their strength seems to lie more with teamfights than 1-on-1. As a mage, I did alright but I felt once my spells were blown I was effectively just bait until my cooldowns reset. If you're the one being focused it's harder to win if you don't know when to go in or lay out your combo.

Without matchmaking it seems like it's hard to get teamfights that aren't focused around people who are superfed versus actual teamwork. But that's something to be addressed later on so I won't be too harsh on that.

I feel overall this game has become much more exciting than it has in the past for me and I'm ready to say I'm in love. I look forward to the future!